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majima
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Kengo:
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You first studied art at a Spanish university, didn't you. How did that
come about?
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majima:
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I don't like being told what to do so I thought I would just go somewhere
and work by myself. I tried France at first but found that it didn't suit
me there so, since I occasionally visited a photographer friend of mine in
Madrid, I thought I might as well go to Spain. There was an art school
there called Circulo Bellas Artes - it was state-supported so the fees were
really low too. There were life models at the school all day and there was
a competition every month with cash prizes. So I decided to study there
since I thought I could do it my own way without being bothered by anyone.
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Kengo:
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After that you attended the Otis Art Institute in Los Angeles. Could you
explain how that happened too? Didn't you consider going to a Japanese art
school?
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majima:
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I had no particular reason for going there either. I first went to Los
Angeles because my parents were transferred over there. And then you need a
visa don't you; can't stay without one.
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Kengo:
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You had to become a student.
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majima:
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That's right. So I got a visa and started going to night school to study
English. Also I went to another school too, since I didn't have any
academic credits. Anyway, I wanted a visa. Then when I got into Otis it was
a lot more interesting.
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Kengo:
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You ended up going on to graduate school didn't you. I guess you could say
you found it interesting (laughs). What sort of classes did you have at
university?
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majima:
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The course load was heavy and they were tough in their critiques. But we
were totally free to work on what we wanted. It wasn't just practical
training: there were plenty of oddball professors in the general education
department, like the music teacher who had his own FM radio station. He
would take us to his station and tell us to listen to the music and express
the images we "heard" in our work. There were others too, like the
psychology professor who was crazy about roller skates.
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Kengo:
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Sounds like a real West Coast story (laughs)
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majima:
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The practical training varied depending on the teacher but for example
there was one professor who liked field study and would always arrange to
meet us somewhere outside. He would give us lectures and so on in all kinds
of places. It was really interesting, but his comments were especially
strict. He would really tear you to pieces. Also, Jim Dine would make his
students help him construct his own art works in the courtyard (laughs). To
my mind it was pretty tough. Students who skipped a lot of classes would
attend as far as the third year but they weren't able to graduate so they
ended up transferring to other schools. As far as the school was concerned,
it was fine if only two or three gifted students graduated each year. They
paid more and more attention to the talented ones and just took the money
from the ones who didn't have what it takes. Anyway, 16 or 17 years have
passed since I graduated so maybe it's different now. In my day you
couldn't get in without upper division credits, but now most students go
straight in as freshmen. That's why it's gone downhill a bit.
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Kengo:
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What impression of the Tokyo art scene did you have when you came back to
Japan in 1981?
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majima:
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I had someone to introduce me when I returned to Japan so I soon made
contact with a Tokyo art gallery, a big one for the time. But they wouldn't
give me my own show.
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Kengo:
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Were you under contract to that gallery?
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majima:
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No, they didn't have contracts like that in Japan then. I didn't know much
about contracts then, but anyway they just didn't have them. But at the
same time they "guarded" you pretty fiercely.
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Kengo:
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Yes, some galleries won't sign a contract but still say "he's our painter".
You still hear stories like that.
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majima:
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They would occasionally buy a piece from me but since I wanted my own
exhibition I arranged through that gallery to have exhibitions at other
places. But various things happened and it didn't work out. There were some
problems at the gallery itself and the person in charge of my work ended up
quitting. So I ended up as a freelance too. Japan was in the reaching peak
of the "bubble" (the prosperity created by the so-called "bubble economy"
in the second half of the 1980s) and so the same thing was happening to
everyone. I sometimes felt like I couldn't take it anymore.
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Kengo:
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And so you took a break from working as an artist and did interior design
for stores instead.
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majima:
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Yes, that was the main thing I was doing. Of course my kids were already in
high school so money was more important. Anyway I could probably have made
money from my art but with the gallery getting pretentious and so on I
thought it was a pretty dangerous situation. On top of that the interior
design business was booming and I found the actual work interesting. I
spent 6 or 7 years at it and did some pretty unique work. Well, it may
still take time and a lot of hard work for my art to be critically accepted
and to sell well - but at that time it just didn't matter. Everyone sold well.
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Kengo:
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Looking at your generation of artists, we can see that you were very quick
to produce pop art works. Other artists of your generation tended toward
the "object school" (mono ha); did you have much contact with them?
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majima:
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Even then there were all kinds of artists. I guess they were in the
avant-garde faction. I don't like belonging to groups and movements like
that. Also, since I didn't get together and talk with them much, I didn't
really understand what they were doing. And I guess because I made these
kind of works, it didn't seem like art to them. Perhaps they were right not
to hang out with me (laughs).
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Kengo:
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However, in 1996 you staged a glorious comeback (laughs). Your recent work
has suddenly attracted a great deal of critical attention.
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majima:
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That's right. I'm really happy about it. Two critics - important ones
(laughs) - came to see "Majimart" (a one man show held at the Mizuma Art
Gallery from November 1997 to January of the following year). We share the
same art materials supplier and he told me that they had the "Majimart"
catalogue at their studios. They praised it highly (laughs). "Huh?!" I
thought - I didn't think anyone appreciated my work, but I guess those two
have started to have better taste.
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Kengo:
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In addition to holding exhibitions in art museums you also lead many
workshops. I've seen one of your workshops at the Tokyo Museum of Modern
Art. I was impressed by the extraordinary enthusiasm of both the adults and
children taking part.
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majima:
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If you think back to when we were young, the art museum was a kind of
sacred space, wasn't it. I for one didn't like it. I'm sure places like
that still exist, but in the future I feel they're going to have to be much
more welcoming, a place that anyone can visit.
That's why we have workshops, that's why I never turn down an invitation to
hold one. Even though they're really hard work. For example, even if it's
children three days is three days where you have to stay focussed all the
time - it's really tiring. But when the work is finished, children feel the
same sense of fulfillment that we do. I often ask that their work be
displayed in the art museum for a while; that would make them happy,
wouldn't it. They could proudly show them to their mothers and fathers. If
we did that it would be a real boost to their self-confidence and it would
probably bring in many family members. Then everyone would understand the
art museums also sponsored this kind of event. If we don't, if only
gradually, open up to the outside like this we'll end up trapped in the
narrow world of art.
Art museums are useless if people don't come: if we don't include all kinds
of events as well as workshops, if there's no entertainment function then
the museum will quickly become divorced from ordinary life. If we don't do
more interesting shows. But this way of thinking isn't at all acceptable
to most people connected to museums, is it.
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Kengo:
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I'd like to ask a few questions about your work as well. Your work centers
on the theme of "food" doesn't it. Art very often deals with issues of sex.
Human physical desires include sex, food, and sleep, but it seems to me
that there are very few artists who work on the theme of "food".
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majima:
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I'm fascinated by "food" because the act of eating is something we do from
the moment we're born to the day we die.
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Kengo:
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I see: I guess you can't really understand sex unless you study it.
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majima:
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That's knowledge you have to grasp, isn't it. Pretty dramatic. (laughs)
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Kengo:
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Eating is a completely everyday thing isn't it.
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majima:
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Yes. But if you think of the meaning of the everyday, it's pop. If
you're wondering how I gradually moved toward the theme of "food", one
reason is that it hasn't been done much up till now. That's also why I
don't know the best way to do it.
Food features quite a bit in novels, films, music and so on. If you think
about it, they all move, don't they. They move and in doing so they develop
the story. It's the same in novels, in anything. When you treat it as art
of course it's OK if it moves, but to express that in a single moment is
difficult.
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Kengo:
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For example you can read a political interpretation even from the minimal
form of the piece called "Hinomaru bento" (rice topped with a pickled plum,
reminiscent of the hinomaru, the Japanese flag), it's a fascinatingly
ambiguous work.
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majima:
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It also has an extremely "pop" image, don't you think? It becomes more and
more interesting as you gradually discover things like that. Also, I
realize that right now "food" is one of my major themes, but pretty soon a
lot of people will be climbing on the bandwagon (laughs). It's not just
limited to Japan: I think the theme of "food" will become an important
theme on around the world.
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Kengo:
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You have a piece in the group show "EAT! the food exhibition" (Museum of
Contemporary Art, Sydney, Australia): does anything strike you as different
when you compare it to an exhibition at a Japanese art museum?
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majima:
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In the first place, the way of running the museum itself is totally
different. There are very few curators, even in a large museum. About 4 or
5 people. Yet altogether there are over 100 staff members.
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Kengo:
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So the curators are able to focus solely on curating.
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majima:
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Yes. I also felt that the role of director of the museum itself was totally
different. I've had exhibitions at various Japanese art museums, yet the
museum director has not once made an appearance at the exhibition. Even
when the artist doesn't come in person but only sends the artworks, the
museum director checks everything with a keen and rigorous eye.
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Kengo:
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That didn't happen in Japanese art museums?
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majima:
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Never. In Japan, the director of the museum has never come in early on the
morning that the exhibition opens, looked around and smiled saying, "It's a
good show. I'm pleased." When it happened abroad it was a good feeling
(laughs).
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(At the artists studio in Ota-ku, Tokyo.)
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